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RE: Why I’m quitting teaching part 11/11: Five ways in which mainstream education doesn't 'fit' society
Thanks for the comment - I basically agree with what you say about soft labels and hard labels... but what makes me cynical is that, well, my parents generation generally grew up into capable adults, my generation generally grew up to be capable adults, which suggests we just don't need these frameworks!
I do accept what you say about there being very general guidelines and possibly useful though, and I guess they can be applied sensitively and have a use.
Good distinction between S and M, I was aware that the latter was 'sounder' but TBH I don't know much about the difference between the two.
You should make a whole post of this!
Not everyone in those generations turned out capable, happy and healthy. People just don't hear much about the people who didn't. You're right though, that we don't need these frameworks. They do help though (or at least the one I have dealt with does, when used well). I don't think it just comes down to if we need something. If we can improve something and that makes life better in some way, even if maybe it isn't at the point of being needed, we should do it. Sometimes we might stuff up and make stuff worse, but the worst thing we can do is not try to move forward. If a child is struggling socially for example, if intervening helps them with that issue earlier than they would solve it themselves and saves them years of struggling to make friends and maybe even being bullied, I think it is worth trying to help and prevent that harm even if they would have solved it themselves by one point, but later than if we helped. If we could successfully help them with those skills earlier (or alternatively find out there's a deeper reason for the struggle they are having), the journey would be a lot nicer for them and the journey wouldn't have hurt them along the way as much. They might still reach the same endpoint themselves where they work the social stuff out (they might not too) so you could say it isn't needed, but maybe they took a longer time to get there and they suffered socially and emotionally during the time it took to develop those skills. In that case, helping would still be the right thing to do, even with the same end result (for those skills - the end result mentally will still be different if they copped a lot of bullying etc along the way).
Also worth noting is that a lot of adults have struggled with things and then their kid get diagnosed with an actual disability or disorder and they discover they have it too, and for some finding out about themselves is the best thing that ever happened to them as they understand where their struggles come from now and they know it's not just a personality trait flaw etc and a lot of help and support (therapy, medications, psychology etc) can come to child and parent in this situation, so that shows that labels definitely can help at the disability level and also that not all adults are finding life easy and feeling capable, happy and healthy. It also doesn't help when people think certain disabilities don't even exist or only affect certain groups of people too.
I think we definitely need labels as a label can be what turns a life around for the better. As for the frameworks, we don't need them but they are a useful tool. We should be aiming to improve on things, either way, regardless of what tools we use.
I think things worked okay in the generations that are now adults, but I also think there is a lot of room for improvement. Things can work, but they can also work really well.
Maybe if labels are used sensitively they have a place!
A one sentence reply with an exclamation mark. That's concerning. I hope this hasn't turned out like Facebook conversations sometimes do, where people mistake discussion for argument. Normally people are happy to discuss on Steemit and Reddit, unlike Facebook. Either way, the response seems to be one to shut down the conversation rather than discuss.
I hope you know that I wasn't arguing with you and I'm sorry if it came across that way. I was addressing what you said in your earlier reply and discussing what I thought was an interesting topic with you. You said about whether we need or it or not, so I was agreeing with you that it wasn't needed, but simply pointing out that it can help, and also pointing out that "we all turned out alright" isn't actually true - that's actually survivor bias and some people have struggled within the groups that turned out alright. I have had absolutely awesome discussions about topics of interest, even when disagreeing to a degree with a person, on places like this and reddit where no-one is arguing or unhappy but there is a back and forth that goes like "Fair enough, I agree about .... but I think x" or "yeah but what about these factors" but unfortunately sometimes those conversations don't eventuate or people think you are arguing and either a) try and shut the conversation down or b) think you are arguing with them and attack you instead (as evidence by instead of disagreement and discussion, insults and nastiness etc). B rarely happens anywhere but facebook, but it still can happen on other platforms. Speaking of schooling, I don't know why they teach you in school how to discuss and debate (not argue) in school if not many people in the real world are interested in real discussion and even take discussion to be arguing.
I'm sorry if it came across as arguing and you felt the need to shut the conversation down. On my end we were having a discussion, so I addressed the points you said and basically said "I agree about the need thing, but we can do better and we should do better with each generation". I just wanted to discuss a point of interest and I thought that's what we doing.
Sorry if it seemed like an argument, that really wasn't the aim. It's sad to see this conversation cut off either way. Sorry if it came across wrong.
If you weren't thinking I was arguing with you, or trying to shut down the conversation, and simply didn't have much to say, then yes, I agree that used sensitively labels may have their place and I'm sorry to have misunderstood your reply.
To be honest I was just feeling a bit brain dead after a week at work and on my phone at the time as I still am which is a barrier to typ8ng. I WILL reply with a more deserving reply later this afternoon!
Have faith!
And I do tend to overuse exlamation marks!
Glad to hear it wasn't my conversation coming across the wrong way. That was what concerned me the most. I completely understand feeling brain dead and not being able to type much, I was just hoping it wasn't due to some misunderstanding of my previous comment. Glad to hear you didn't see my discussion as argument.
No no, not at all, just a bad time of the week/ term.
Bad time of the term set to continue and probably worsen for the rest of May!
Thankfully today's looking good.