Response to theymos's(Bitcointalk admin) post regarding Steem, and his claims dismissed.
This post was posted by Theymos, bitcointalk admin, here while having a discussion about whether Steemit links should be banned on bitcointalk.
It seems to me that steem is a classic scamcoin, and steemit is being astroturfed like crazy. However, if a steemit link contains substantial, on-topic content, then the shadyness of steem/steemit doesn't warrant removing the link.
My response:
It seems to me that steem is a classic scamcoin.
Let's talk about Steem as a platform first of all.
Mate, you know nothing about Steem. Have you even bothered checking out our community before reaching to a conclusion on what Steem really is? You probably have seen worse shitcoins in your lifetime, and yet you're calling Steem, which is a perfectly legitimate cryptocurrency, a scamcoin.
Have you bothered to check out what Steem is really backed by? What makes Steem so special, and what makes Steem a great platform for people like us who are already using Steem to express our opinions, and benefit out of sharing our opinion? Steem is backed by original content that is authored by users that willingly accept Steem currencies as a form of payment. What's wrong with that? It's like writing an article on a newspaper and getting paid for it.
Now, Steem as a currency.
Steem is a perfectly legitimate cryptocurrency. Why? Because it has all the properties that bitcoin has - non reversible transactions, decentralized network, and a community behind it. Can Ned or Dan reverse payments on the Steem network? No.
Is Steem a pump and dump coin? No. Sure, price has been volatile, but people have shown interest in buying in more of these coins because they know what the platform is capable of bringing us all. It will revolutionize social media, as well as blockchain technology. There has been no dumps that have taken place in a matter of seconds, crashing the price to mere satoshis.
and steemit is being astroturfed like crazy.
Um. Not sure what you're talking about here. There is no paid public support here, even if the network is designed to pay for good posts. Are people forcing us to say something? No. We can literally speak for ourselves, just like Reddit or Twitter. There is no censorship. Even the whales respect our opinions. If your argument is that we are being forced into writing pro-Steem articles, then you're wrong. People criticize Steem all the time, and make suggestions for improvement. This isn't a fascist regime. I have wrote about food in the past, and still get upvotes for it. And AFAIK, ned and dan aren't personally paying anyone to join the network and say good things about it, apart from the $10 Steempower, which they are not even able to cashout until they hit 10x.
99.99% of the people here love Steem, and they may say good things about it. How's that bad? To say something that you truly mean? 99.99% of the Steemians are legit, honest people. And 100% Steemers don't get paid to say something good about Steem, by the owners. Steem has strong grassroot support.
It's damn simple. Steem is not paying for public support.
Your forum, on the other hand, is CENTRALIZED AND CENSORED. You can do whatever you want with your forum, expel users, add new users, ban users. It's all up to you. Even giving negative trust to innocent users is possible. You have to admit that Steem resolves all these problems, by having a decentralized social media. And this is why people are interested in it.
However, if a steemit link contains substantial, on-topic content, then the shadyness of steem/steemit doesn't warrant removing the link.
Let's talk spam.
I'm telling you now, that your bitcointalk articles are the ones that are NOT ON TOPIC. Take a tour of the forum, and you'll see a ton of people spamming useless stuff just to get paid a few cents for their signature. Your forum is flooded with signature spam. I doubt you can call your forum containing "substantial, on-topic content".
And take a look at Steemit, there are lots of actual people that love what they do - writing articles online. They actually share their life experiences. They write detailed introduceyourself posts. They love each other. They don't hate each other like you guys do on Bitcointalk.
And your thing regarding the shadyness of Steem - anything to back it up? If you say that the whales are controlling the majority of the Steem supply, then, doesn't the same thing apply to bitcoin? Doesn't the same thing apply to fiat currency? Doesn't the same thing apply to shares?
Conclusion:
Look man, I appreciate your effort in warning the bitcoin community about a potential threat. I understand that you have seen so many scams in your life that even you can't keep count. Especially ICOs, pump and dumps and things like that. But take my word for it - Steem is not one of them.
I strongly suggest you check out Steemit fully, register an account before blatantly saying speech of hate about it. You'll find lots of interesting discussion, and a very, very clean interface. Much better than the outdated one of yours, as well as the new one that you have been promising for years.
Steem is an honest project, with an excellent community.
And the best is yet to come.
Here here, now that's a response lol. I'm having a hard time comprehending why there's so much negativity out there from some people about steemit. The sites legit, the payouts are real, the investment is real. If anything let's take a look at exchanges and some of the shady shit they do, just saying.
Anyways awesome article!
Im sure the post will earn you thousands, but if "astroturfing" means what i assume it means from the context ,your assertion is pretty ridiculous. I guess it does no good to keep saying it, but a transparent attempt to hide a readily apparent truth is only going to hurt the credibility of the platform.. if downvoting didnt effect others rep, id be doing it on this one.
And the part about centralization is intellectually dishonest. Steemit can ban users, hide their posts, and do all those things too.
Um. Why is my assertion ridiculous within the context exactly?
Maybe I misunderstood what astroturfing meant all those years...
I assume it means paid support... like hiring shills to talk up your product. There are a ton of people that have flat out admitted thats what goes on. And even if they had not, its so obvious I cringe every time i see the front page.
The fact that you wrap the paycheck in a vote doesnt change the fact that its a paycheck. And trying to dodge a manifestly obvious truth with a charade about voting. Well it makes the platform look scammy.
Exactly. But is Steemit really paying for people to talk up their products? Steemit in my opinion is offering pay for people to contribute to the overall value of the platform. The posts can be anything - related to anything. You see people posting introduceyourself posts that get paid a lot. Is that astroturfing?
I understand what you're talking about, but I don't think your point is completely valid. But I appreciate you taking time in discussing this issue.
I get what youre saying, but it seems to me exactly the way it will seem to everyone else: like youre arguing a technicality. When the whales at steem are referring to their writers as employees. When you have a guy who says "yeah the owners recruited me to the site thats why i made 20K on a post" thats not people talking about whatever they want.
And also, the fact that talking points get passed down to the main recruits could not be clearer.
So what you have a bunch of people, recruited to "add value to the site" being paid to hit specific talking points.
Now I don't have a problem with this happening, though i think it could be handled in a less hamfisted manner, but denying it when its obviously going on makes the platform look like a scam.
While you're sort of on the right idea with this.. Just because it's censored by steemit.com doesn't mean it isn't visible on the STEEMchain..
STEEM is decentralized. Steemit.com is merely a GUI to access STEEM.
Theymos's forum is about as far from democracy as you can get sadly.
I've seen censorship first hand there. You can't really censor what's on STEEM.
Sorry no. It is DPoS with 19 witnesses. And Dan & Ned control the stake.
Nicely said. Even if Steemit censors your posts(which i haven't seen many cases of, apart from bots), it is still accessible on the blockchain.
so people will be able to read it with what, the command line tool? and i guess if they ban you you can still posst with the command line tool too.
Steem can hide someones posts from 95% of the users on the platform. Attempting to escape that with a technicality, again makes you look disingenuous and the platform look shady.
Im not really a crypto guy. I buy a lot of BTC for my law practice, and i heard about this from one of the dudes I buy btc from. Put 20K in cashed out 100 and powered up 6.
So i have no idea if its better than bitcoin talk. But my point isnt that i don't like steem, or its better than that or worse than this. My point is that singing untrue praises -- and its clear to even a casual user that there is a high degree of centralization on the platform -- then having them upvoted and showcased is ultimately harmful..
Also, ftr, the problem isnt just you. the problem is they upvote and encourage posts like this until the front page looks like an informercial.
Don't you think that is at least better than bitcointalk? They are way worse than Steem. Why does theymos have the right to talk trash about Steem when his site is worse?
Also, Steemit is open source. If people think that the Steemit admins are abusing their powers, we can move to another platform. And lines of code is what underlies these GUIs.
Oh man just leave the hater alone ,
I think he got jealous because now btc talk traffic so dull , every body moving to steemit .
Adios btc talk. .
Hi steemit better place to earning money.
When theymos attacks you, you know Steem is on to something. Remember the epic attack he did against Ether when it was starting to take off?
The scam accusation probably has to do with the 80 - 90% sneaky "pre"-mine and the fact that the concentration of the tokens is orders-of-magnitude worse than a natural power-distribution of wealth. So basically we have most of the top 50 whales cashing out while the n00bs are paying for it with their effort and investment into the platform.
I don't see STEEM as a currency like bitcoin, it is only designed to be held for very short times, due to it's 100% annual inflation rate. Now steem dollars (SBD) that could be a valid currency.
In saying that, I am very confident for the future of steemit and I generally agree with your sentiment
I'm saying this as a fact that Steem is a legit cryptocurrency. It's irreversible, and decentralized. Inflation is simply another thing, that doesn't take the legitimacy away from Steem. Of course, you can always power up.
But I agree fully with the second part of your comment. I believe in Steem as well.
Man this was a good read thanks. Bitcointalk's theymos is jelly for his wacked out forum ain't making him what Steemit is making. That place is a joke this place is heaven. So let's make steemit golden.
Well said!
Bitcoin is also becoming a scamcoin.. You can hardly use it to pay for stuff due to the slowness caused by full blocks!
I don't think that bitcoin is a scamcoin. However, the blocks is definitely an issue that bitcoin is facing right now.
"becoming"...
I used to (until half a years ago) buy a lot of stuff using Bitcoin, because it was quick and secure. Zero-conf was no issue whatsoever.. Nowadays this has changed.. So Bitcoin was used as a digital currency to pay for stuff. If I can no longer do that, and it might be getting worse.. What is Bitcoin then good for? Investment? Not what I signed up for.. I want to order Pizza :D
Haha.
Steemit is a threat to the forums that Theymos controls and censors.
Indeed. Theymos's forum is centralized, while Steem is decentralized. Theymos is the dictator on Bitcointalk, while really, there is no dictator on Steem at all. Not even ned, or dan.
Nice thanks for helping me clarify about my post too :D
Thanks for reading!