RE: HF21: SPS and EIP Explained
IMO people working on EIP, SPS, witnesses, and developers are all making a sincere efforts to improve Steem. If you think anyone is acting against the best interests of Steem overall you are entitled that view and IMO should absolutely call it out.
I do not think this. I think change is positive and has to be done. My original point is the apportionment of the funding.
I am not going to call out individuals but it is the perception of many day to day users that creators are ignored or considered almost a nuisance. You may consider this anecdotal, but as one of those creators in communication with many other creators, that is a perception that is held.
Discussion between witnesses and developers (Steemit in this case). This discussion is advisory and can not truly commit to anything because the witness list may change (see #3 below).
So this advisory discussion involved the witnesses proposing not to shoulder any of the burden of the 10%..?
The true decision may ultimately be the stakeholders but if an unpopular change gets in you know how long it may take to get it out.
There is a release undergoing testing. Which means the code base barring any major defects is almost complete.
Witnesses decide whether to approve/activate the fork implemented by the release. Stakeholders can change witness votes to influence the process.
It's too late at this point. This is reactive. I say be proactive and air concerns before it gets to this stage. The later a change is required in the dev cycle the more expensive that change become to implement.
Hence me airing my concern.
Some witnesses proposed no change to witness rewards including myself for the reasons already stated. To reiterate, witness rewards were already cut 80% in a previous adjustment, one which conducted a reasonable modeling of the minimum safe witness reward structure. The (soon) existence of the SPS does nothing to change that modeling nor does it change a reasonable assessment of the minimum safe witness reward structure. In fact, I would argue based on this sound logic, that if you think the shift from the reward pool of 10% is too high and it should only be 9%, instead of trying to make an unsupported reduction in witness rewards to make up the difference, SPS itself should just be reduced from 10% to 9%. But I personally do not see the need for that all, and I think SPS benefits more from that 10% increase than the rewards pool would benefit from not losing that last 1.5%.
Other witnesses proposed to shift some witness rewards, but ultimately a majority if not supermajority of witnesses were not in favor of that, and not doing so is what the developers (who are also large stakeholders themselves) decided to code.
You are free to view this as unfair self-enrichment or some such, which seems to be the undercurrent of what you are implying even if you don't come out and say it, but I don't. I sincerely believe that nearly if not literally everyone involved on all sides of these issues wants the best for Steem and very few if any witnesses are strongly motivated to maximize their witness rewards beyond what is truly necessary and responsible as a system design. In truth, it just isn't a lot of money for most who are successful investors, business owners, well-paid developers, etc. to even justify the hassles involved, including debates like this one, so we are all must be far more motivated to help make Steem a success, or if not most of us would probably just frankly quit.
In the end, as I said, stakeholders will decide.
These exact same concerns were aired several months ago when the SPS was first proposed and developed its funding was discussed. There is very little being brought up now that wasn't already brought up then.
Then, just as now, some suggested that some witness rewards be shifted to cover the cost, and some suggested that witness rewards not be shifted. Some suggested that reward pool be shift, some suggested that SPS be funded only by donations.
What happened more recently is that witnesses and developers had a discussion, considering all of the views that were aired several months ago and since about whether and how SPS should be funded, and the informal consensus that came out discussion was for the 65/15/10/10 split. Ultimately the stakeholders will decide.
I see this and I think. Aren't we all stakeholders? Shouldn't a discussion have at least been considered over all stakeholders and not just a subset. There are many ways to do this now.
Shouldn't all stakeholders have an input earlier in the cycle to avoid costly decisions having to be made?
A proposal could have been made to all stakeholders. A for and against. But there wasn't. Do the views of non developer, non witness stakeholders not count. Or do they count at a later stage when the code has been written and as I said before it becomes far more expensive to change.
For the record then, I imply nothing. I view it as unfair and maintain it my right to do so.
Is this discussion onerous to you, a hassle? Then let us agree to disagree. I am happy to move on. I have stated what I think which I believe I am free to do. You have stated what you think which is indeed also your right.
Yes and yes, and that has been the case, starting several months ago when the SPS was proposed and discussed, and in numerous ongoing discussions since. So, if you are asking whether input from non-witnesses and developers is a part of this process and is directly considered, then I would say yes. If you are suggesting that all stakeholders and platform users are directly and personally involved with the development and collaborative discussions supporting development on a day to day basis, I would say no, that is not practical (and indeed is the very reason why Steem, and most current DPoS blockchains, was designed with a modestly-sized witness set: there is a limit to the number of people who can constructively have personal involvement in such a process without everything becoming too unwieldy; at a technical level it would work to have not a top 20 but a top 200 or even more, but from a practical standpoint when the network is seen as something evolving, that is impractical).
It isn't extreme, but it is still a meaningful added time commitment for those witnesses who choose to engage personally in these discussions with the community (this particular one only being an example, I'm not calling it out as a specific concern). Those that don't are criticized for being out of touch and not engaging. I can understand and see the merits of both approaches, particularly when witnesses are being paid about as much as a fast food worker (or maybe, given that the Steem price has recovered a bit recently, a fast food manager), before expenses, and then are accused of using their position to do "unfair" things to in order to protect their pay check.
That is exactly what is being done. The process of on-chain governance allows all stakeholders to have a say for or against approval/activation of forks.
Disagree, as stated above. A wide range of views from non-developers and non-witnesses have absolutely been heard and taken into account earlier in the process starting months ago, including on the matter of how and how much (and if) SPS should be funded. Ultimately witnesses and developers make a practical call to distill that down to what concrete implementation they think is best for Steem. They/we may well get some things wrong but we consider all sorts of input and do our best.
Ah, I see now.
You think I am accusing the witnesses, ergo yourself.
I am not going to retread everything I have said but...
I will say that yes, I believe it is unfair. I do not believe that adequate input from non-witnesses and developers has been sought.
I believe that in this case, there is too much bias, conscious or unconscious on the parties involved to make the decision to not include themselves fair.
I am not alone as you have stated.
I am happy to end it here.
I honestly appreciate the feedback and input
I have appreciated the discussion!
Yes, and it was never a case. I would really appreciate a system in which we have a fixed maximum percentage for any budget line minus the part outvoted by all the stakeholders.
Like for example max 2% for witnesses, but if 50% of all stakeholders have voted for "minus" it would be 1% only.
A huge amount of computing power is spent to decide that this particular meme will get a few cents more that another meme. Some part of this computing power surely could be reallocated to allow all the stakeholders have a say on the global parameters too.