The problem with forking chains is that while you may get a functioning chain, access to centralized exchanges remains a choking point. Without access to exchanges, there is no liquidity and thus no value. Tron is probably more expensive to run than Steem. It has a virtual machine and a lot of the apps run on it execute code (smart contracts) on chain, which is expensive. Without money coming in from exchanges, the super representatives of our chain would have to subsidize running their nodes themselves.
A credible fork could get exchange listings so what you describe here would be a short-term problem.
I understand if you are anti-TRON, but how long can STEEM survive without new capital, marketing and development? As much as we all have been disappointed by steemit in the past they are still going to leave a hole in the ecosystem.
The owner of Binance is Sun's old pal. Sun owns Poloniex. Exchange listings are not free.
I'm not anti-Tron in the least. I'm anti-hostile takeover. I'm all for blockchain interoperability and multi-chain apps. That sort of thing would only strengthen the total network effect of the entire space. The only thing standing in the way of getting there is the brain dead tribalism and greed of troglodytes. There are way bigger fish to fry than misguided Bitcoin maximalists or bunch of narcissists who think the crypto space is some cheap 80's flick about the Wall Street. We're really up against the likes of Facebook and other centralized entities who are out to increase their already excessive power over us.
Even if Sun is frustrated in his hostile takeover attempts (that seems to be his goal going by his tweets and news stories all over the Internet) and decides to shut down Steemit, Inc, we can still use the chain because we'd have the SMT protocol and communities operational.
I don't think that what I am describing above could be classed a "hostile takeover" but I do realise that may have been the original intent behind the steemit purchase and "token swap" idea.
I guess I just don't want to see STEEM degenerate into another divisive shit-show over this. I've seen enough and was actually forming the opinion that we were finally turning the corner ahead of the next crypto bull run.
Well, that's well thought out and looks like a highly functional direction to take things, but I do prefer Steem retains it's token and blockchain independently of Tron. There's some question as to whether the CCP may end up calling shots on Tron, which concerns me regarding Opera and BT already.
Steem has been a pretty good media platform if you're interested in censorship resistance, and that is my primary interest.
I would prefer that too, but the potential benefits from a synergistic relationship with TRON are pretty massive. We would always have the option to fork TRON ourselves if CCP became a problem.
'What profit is it to a man to gain the whole world, but lose his soul?'
I see potential benefits. I'm unwilling to trade censorship resistance for them. I see free speech as an existential necessity, not a luxury, and I don't think it's ever easy to fork anything, much less contrary to the will of overlords.
I have proposed that we make it obvious that Steem is more valuable to Tron without becoming an organ of it. I think that is the best of all possible worlds for all concerned.
We grow. Social media has proved to be the most profitable business model the world has ever produced. FAANGs prove it. Steem, if it can become suitable for wider adoption and grow virally, will combine that business model with cryptocurrency. Tron isn't interested in Steem as a currency, but if Steem enables outlets for Tron then that's one avenue for Steem to benefit Tron.
Presently Tron is ~20 times larger than Steem, but Tron isn't a social media mechanism, but has IIRC been developed as a media sharing mechanism. BT is a vitally important tech that Steem should be using instead of a centralized website to serve content amongst it's users, as @edicted has proposed.
I hope that something that Tron can help us do. If we can grow and provide Tron outlets for it's tech/token to be adopted, then it's in Tron's interest to not break what doesn't need fixing.
This is just my off the top of my head thought. Better minds than mine are hopefully considering ways to ensure we don't get swallowed up by Tron and lose our ownership of our content, our freedom of speech, or our pseudonymity.
Well, as I tried to explain before you told me that I waste my time with it: It's technically not feasible to implement the functionality of steem on TRON. If you want to know the details, inform yourself about the protocols and the code, I see you are a developer too.
Witnesses are not against this because they fear about their position. Their job is to protect the integrity of the chain. Switching to a protocol that's 5x slower and even by their own maximum claims (which are doubted to be true by researchers) 5-50x less scalable is endangering the biggest asset we have besides the community, the technical base to run something like this.
I did not tell you that you were wasting your time. You've mis-interpreted my comment. I was lamenting that I was wasting my OWN time - more broadly speaking - by seeking some kind of pragmatic compromise that might work for both TRON and STEEM. I should probably nuke this post as even though I do have a dev background and have scanned some of the source, I'm not a blockchain engineer at this point. Sun seems to think he can migrate STEEM / Steemit to TRON and he has enough resources behind him to get it done. Whether that means a core upgrade to TRON or it can be done just via Smart Contracts is probably just semantics.
But sure. Point taken. If this exchange is indicative of how it's going to play out then the writing on the wall and I'm done here. Thanks for dropping by, you can fuck off now.
Ignoring every single point I make, telling me I would be tribal when I'm just realistic, and telling me you'd waste your time with my efforts to explain things I understand a lot more about than you made me feel like telling you to fuck off first too. I decided to keep giving you hints to understand, I believe in the ability of people to change their opinions when they learn new facts.
Tron is Java. It's not possible to update it to resemble the performance of steem, which is based on graphene written in C++ and highly optimized for tps.
If anything, the functionality of TRON could easily be added to steem. The other way around would require reinventing the wheel (= building a new TRON from ground up).
There you go, if you don't get it now I'll leave you alone with your fanboydom.
The problem with this is that because Tron is so centralized, this setup is one Tron hard fork away from fucking everyone on Steem-Tron over.
If that ever became a problem couldn't we just fork TRON ourselves?
The problem with forking chains is that while you may get a functioning chain, access to centralized exchanges remains a choking point. Without access to exchanges, there is no liquidity and thus no value. Tron is probably more expensive to run than Steem. It has a virtual machine and a lot of the apps run on it execute code (smart contracts) on chain, which is expensive. Without money coming in from exchanges, the super representatives of our chain would have to subsidize running their nodes themselves.
A credible fork could get exchange listings so what you describe here would be a short-term problem.
I understand if you are anti-TRON, but how long can STEEM survive without new capital, marketing and development? As much as we all have been disappointed by steemit in the past they are still going to leave a hole in the ecosystem.
The owner of Binance is Sun's old pal. Sun owns Poloniex. Exchange listings are not free.
I'm not anti-Tron in the least. I'm anti-hostile takeover. I'm all for blockchain interoperability and multi-chain apps. That sort of thing would only strengthen the total network effect of the entire space. The only thing standing in the way of getting there is the brain dead tribalism and greed of troglodytes. There are way bigger fish to fry than misguided Bitcoin maximalists or bunch of narcissists who think the crypto space is some cheap 80's flick about the Wall Street. We're really up against the likes of Facebook and other centralized entities who are out to increase their already excessive power over us.
Even if Sun is frustrated in his hostile takeover attempts (that seems to be his goal going by his tweets and news stories all over the Internet) and decides to shut down Steemit, Inc, we can still use the chain because we'd have the SMT protocol and communities operational.
I don't think that what I am describing above could be classed a "hostile takeover" but I do realise that may have been the original intent behind the steemit purchase and "token swap" idea.
I guess I just don't want to see STEEM degenerate into another divisive shit-show over this. I've seen enough and was actually forming the opinion that we were finally turning the corner ahead of the next crypto bull run.
It won't be a "hostile takeover" but a "peaceful assimilation".
Well, that's well thought out and looks like a highly functional direction to take things, but I do prefer Steem retains it's token and blockchain independently of Tron. There's some question as to whether the CCP may end up calling shots on Tron, which concerns me regarding Opera and BT already.
Steem has been a pretty good media platform if you're interested in censorship resistance, and that is my primary interest.
Thanks!
I would prefer that too, but the potential benefits from a synergistic relationship with TRON are pretty massive. We would always have the option to fork TRON ourselves if CCP became a problem.
'What profit is it to a man to gain the whole world, but lose his soul?'
I see potential benefits. I'm unwilling to trade censorship resistance for them. I see free speech as an existential necessity, not a luxury, and I don't think it's ever easy to fork anything, much less contrary to the will of overlords.
I have proposed that we make it obvious that Steem is more valuable to Tron without becoming an organ of it. I think that is the best of all possible worlds for all concerned.
I reckon we should focus on making that happen.
How is this done beyond writing the occasional puff-piece?
We grow. Social media has proved to be the most profitable business model the world has ever produced. FAANGs prove it. Steem, if it can become suitable for wider adoption and grow virally, will combine that business model with cryptocurrency. Tron isn't interested in Steem as a currency, but if Steem enables outlets for Tron then that's one avenue for Steem to benefit Tron.
Presently Tron is ~20 times larger than Steem, but Tron isn't a social media mechanism, but has IIRC been developed as a media sharing mechanism. BT is a vitally important tech that Steem should be using instead of a centralized website to serve content amongst it's users, as @edicted has proposed.
I hope that something that Tron can help us do. If we can grow and provide Tron outlets for it's tech/token to be adopted, then it's in Tron's interest to not break what doesn't need fixing.
This is just my off the top of my head thought. Better minds than mine are hopefully considering ways to ensure we don't get swallowed up by Tron and lose our ownership of our content, our freedom of speech, or our pseudonymity.
Agreed.
Yes. Very amusing. I'd give you more kudos though if I hadn't already seen it in another thread :)
I can't just assume everyone has seen my shitposting, now can I?
Well, as I tried to explain before you told me that I waste my time with it: It's technically not feasible to implement the functionality of steem on TRON. If you want to know the details, inform yourself about the protocols and the code, I see you are a developer too.
Witnesses are not against this because they fear about their position. Their job is to protect the integrity of the chain. Switching to a protocol that's 5x slower and even by their own maximum claims (which are doubted to be true by researchers) 5-50x less scalable is endangering the biggest asset we have besides the community, the technical base to run something like this.
I did not tell you that you were wasting your time. You've mis-interpreted my comment. I was lamenting that I was wasting my OWN time - more broadly speaking - by seeking some kind of pragmatic compromise that might work for both TRON and STEEM. I should probably nuke this post as even though I do have a dev background and have scanned some of the source, I'm not a blockchain engineer at this point. Sun seems to think he can migrate STEEM / Steemit to TRON and he has enough resources behind him to get it done. Whether that means a core upgrade to TRON or it can be done just via Smart Contracts is probably just semantics.
But sure. Point taken. If this exchange is indicative of how it's going to play out then the writing on the wall and I'm done here. Thanks for dropping by, you can fuck off now.
Ignoring every single point I make, telling me I would be tribal when I'm just realistic, and telling me you'd waste your time with my efforts to explain things I understand a lot more about than you made me feel like telling you to fuck off first too. I decided to keep giving you hints to understand, I believe in the ability of people to change their opinions when they learn new facts.
Tron is Java. It's not possible to update it to resemble the performance of steem, which is based on graphene written in C++ and highly optimized for tps.
If anything, the functionality of TRON could easily be added to steem. The other way around would require reinventing the wheel (= building a new TRON from ground up).
There you go, if you don't get it now I'll leave you alone with your fanboydom.
huh? you are leaving? :-(
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