Nominal political will suffices to enable appropriate incentives to discourage immigration. Those same potential mechanisms will not deter military forces, however, and for that a wall is actually useful. The real problem with a wall on US borders is that will prevent Americans from voting with their feet in the event of catastrophe, of whatever source.
I am 100% against a physical barrier like the Berlin Wall preventing free people from leaving at will. Consider that if some godawful disaster began wreaking havoc in Texas, and FEMA was pulling a NOLA while a wall kept people from fleeing to safety across the border, because we had a temporary need to resort to a wall due to a lack of spine to stop illegal immigrants, many people could actually be harmed by a wall, good Texans all.
Jack Kennedy made the point that America has never needed a wall to keep it's people in, and I'll agree with that - until things get bad enough that Americans may actually want to leave. Since the USA is now the most indebted and incarcerated nation in the history of the Earth, that may not be as farfetched as it seems. It wouldn't take a whole lot of things getting worse before most folks might think it's time to go.
People are actually moving to Mexico now, as a result of political oppression in the USA, as sad and cowardly as that seems to us.
tl;dr we don't need a wall to keep strays out. We just need to let the Border Patrol do it's job.
Every wall has two sides. It can't do one unless it can do the other. Only honest folks in control of it can keep it from being used to keep us in if we want to go. In your experience of government, how likely is that to be perfect and permanent?
In mine, it's neither right now.
Edit: also, why do we even need a wall at all? What's keeping Border Patrol from doing it's job, as it has more or less for decades before?
Politics, and nothing else. How will a wall make our politicians better? If they're just as corrupt after a wall is up as they are now, they're going to get the invaders through it, over it, and around it anyway, because that's what corrupt politicians are paid to do.
This influx of immigrants is a result of corrupt politics, not the incompetence of the Border Patrol or lack of a wall. Prior to 1965 and the change in immigration policy, we didn't have this problem. It's deliberate, created by politicians, and going to keep happening with a wall too, because politicians can make a wall as porous as air.
"Q: why do you NOT want the President to uphold the law?"
What does that have to do with the issue?
Q: why do you want murderous thugs to kill Americans?
See? I misrepresent you just as easily as you misrepresent me.
No point in that. You don't want to address the actual points I did make, just say so. Don't put words in my mouth. I've got enough in there that I put there already. Ain't no room for extra.
I don't want murderous thugs to kill americans..that's why I want a wall.
both around my personal property. (fences, security systems...and last ditch bangs) as well as an outer permitter...a southern border wall. A wall between the Western states and the United states would just be gravy.
I appreciate your position. Having fled jurisdictions before, I am unwilling to create barriers to doing so. Hell, that's how I got to Texas in the first place.
I can accept that we disagree. I'd be unhappy if I couldn't find folks to set me straight when I'm wrong, and hope you are equally willing to accept my own adherence to what I think is right, even when you don't agree with me.
We don't need a wall for that.
Nominal political will suffices to enable appropriate incentives to discourage immigration. Those same potential mechanisms will not deter military forces, however, and for that a wall is actually useful. The real problem with a wall on US borders is that will prevent Americans from voting with their feet in the event of catastrophe, of whatever source.
I am 100% against a physical barrier like the Berlin Wall preventing free people from leaving at will. Consider that if some godawful disaster began wreaking havoc in Texas, and FEMA was pulling a NOLA while a wall kept people from fleeing to safety across the border, because we had a temporary need to resort to a wall due to a lack of spine to stop illegal immigrants, many people could actually be harmed by a wall, good Texans all.
Jack Kennedy made the point that America has never needed a wall to keep it's people in, and I'll agree with that - until things get bad enough that Americans may actually want to leave. Since the USA is now the most indebted and incarcerated nation in the history of the Earth, that may not be as farfetched as it seems. It wouldn't take a whole lot of things getting worse before most folks might think it's time to go.
People are actually moving to Mexico now, as a result of political oppression in the USA, as sad and cowardly as that seems to us.
tl;dr we don't need a wall to keep strays out. We just need to let the Border Patrol do it's job.
the border wall keeps people OUT.
Not In.
Every wall has two sides. It can't do one unless it can do the other. Only honest folks in control of it can keep it from being used to keep us in if we want to go. In your experience of government, how likely is that to be perfect and permanent?
In mine, it's neither right now.
Edit: also, why do we even need a wall at all? What's keeping Border Patrol from doing it's job, as it has more or less for decades before?
Politics, and nothing else. How will a wall make our politicians better? If they're just as corrupt after a wall is up as they are now, they're going to get the invaders through it, over it, and around it anyway, because that's what corrupt politicians are paid to do.
This influx of immigrants is a result of corrupt politics, not the incompetence of the Border Patrol or lack of a wall. Prior to 1965 and the change in immigration policy, we didn't have this problem. It's deliberate, created by politicians, and going to keep happening with a wall too, because politicians can make a wall as porous as air.
The problem is politics, not construction.
The wall is the law. Passed by a democratic congress and signed into law in 2006.
Q: why do you NOT want the President to uphold the law?
What does that have to do with the issue?
Q: why do you want murderous thugs to kill Americans?
See? I misrepresent you just as easily as you misrepresent me.
No point in that. You don't want to address the actual points I did make, just say so. Don't put words in my mouth. I've got enough in there that I put there already. Ain't no room for extra.
I don't want murderous thugs to kill americans..that's why I want a wall.
both around my personal property. (fences, security systems...and last ditch bangs) as well as an outer permitter...a southern border wall. A wall between the Western states and the United states would just be gravy.
LOL
I appreciate your position. Having fled jurisdictions before, I am unwilling to create barriers to doing so. Hell, that's how I got to Texas in the first place.
I can accept that we disagree. I'd be unhappy if I couldn't find folks to set me straight when I'm wrong, and hope you are equally willing to accept my own adherence to what I think is right, even when you don't agree with me.